Every woman who's ever held any type of service or sales job knows about one of the major inherent hazards associated with their chosen profession.Namely, the unavoidable encounters with creepy fucking dudes.
Fortunately, most men today possess enough intelligence to realize women employed in the sales / service industry act in a pleasant manner simply because everyone in that type of postion has to in order to make a living.
Because that's their fucking job.
They would like you to buy something.
They would like to earn a nice tip.
They represent the face of their employer.
But then you have the skeevy, lecherous, bottom-dwelling jackasses who simply don't understand this phenomenon.
The instant you smile or make prolonged eye contact with one of these pathetic assclowns in your working environment, they are absolutely convinced, for whatever reason, that you are somehow in love with them.
That your smile somehow reveals a crush. Or the way you stood next to him when you tried to sell him that new cellphone obviously meant you wanted to fuck him. Or because the real estate agent took that extra time to show a bedroom, she of course was implying that she wanted to have sex with him in that bedroom.
I'll give you another example.
I used to work in a scummy industry, and my boss epitomized the rancid, fecal crust that rose to the top of his trade. We'll call him Lee.
Lee would prostitute his own mother if he could figure out a way to get three dollars out of it. He easily made mid-six figures a year, but he was so cheap he wore the same ratty, wrinkled, off-white oxford shirt with yellow pit stains on it every day for weeks on end.
He never tipped at restaurants, but always provided female waitresses with his signature punchline: "If you're wondering where your tip is, it's in the price of the food."
And then he'd smile at her, waiting for her to smile back, because he thought his little punchline was pretty cute. Then, as promised, he'd leave her nothing.
He was morbidly obese, and he also regularly paid some back-alley bodychopper to plug dead horsehair into his forehead until his hairline looked like something you might use to scrape lichen off a barn.
So at some point, Lee began mouthing off about a certain barista that "kept hitting on him." When I was offered the opportunity to help him pick up a large order, I decided to go along to see what kind of near-blind, socially inept female buffoon worked at this coffee stand.
She was a beautiful, but very shy, girl in her early 20's.
And she was fucking terrified of Lee. I could see it in her eyes.
But she smiled nervously as Lee kept telling her she had "luscious legs" or "lovely breasts," simply because she needed to keep her job. She was too afraid to tell Lee to go fuck himself.
"Didn't you see the way she smiles at me?" he asked after we left.
Two weeks later, the owner banned Lee from the coffee shop.
Go figure.
And all Lee could talk about at work was how that manager had totally ruined his chances of fucking this hot teenage chick that was "totally into him."
"I'll find her," he'd say, "and I bet you she'll be blowing me within 5 minutes."
You're absolutely right, Lee. Because beautiful 20 year-old college girls always fall for fat, cheap, balding 50 year-old fuckstains who wear the same shirt for 14 days in a row.
You ignorant ass.
Kate writes in to PLFM with a similar story, but in her case, her "client" stepped over the line when he started contacting Kate at home.
Kate works at a small biotech lab located on the campus of her local university. Kate's company specializes in DNA sequencing and bacteria analysis for a number of other local labs.
Kate had a longtime client named Rick who frequently came in to Kate's lab to drop off samples for his company. She was always friendly with Rick, simply because part of her job entailed maintaining profitable relationships with her roster of clients.
But off the record, Kate wasn't fond of Rick. He tended to act like a braying ass when any opportunity to do so presented itself.
Kate explains:
"He's the type of guy who always wants to be the "white knight," riding in and saving the damsel in distress. He once offered to go an beat up the mechanic of a co-worker of his when they, in Rick's view, overcharged her for car repairs."
We all know exactly what you're talking about Kate.
He's the macho, small-cocked blowhard keen on making empty threats of physical violence towards others to "impress" and "protect" the ladies.
Let's all yawn as a group, shall we?
Kate knew Rick had a wife and two kids, and Rick knew that Kate had a long-term live-in boyfriend with whom she had a son and shared a farm.
But at some point, these factors suddenly became irrelevant to Rick.
Rick began stopping by Kate's office every time he came into her company's headquarters. He'd sit around and hit on Kate, and Kate was cordial at best simply because she had to be. Kate also noticed that Rick began to remove his wedding ring as he entered her office.
Rick's efforts got him nowhere however, so he began asking Kate out to lunch.
He'd ask her on Monday, and she would politely say "no." He'd ask her out on Tuesday, and she'd politely say "no" again.
Utilizing the "Can I have a cookie?" process employed by cunning six year-olds worldwide, Rick continued asking Kate out to lunch, figuring Kate would eventually crack under the pressure and agree to have lunch with him.
No dice.
Kate stood her ground.
Rick then reached deep into his arsenal of tired seduction tricks and found the "backrub routine" sandwiched between his fake Ferrari key and his "I'm a movie producer" line.
Kate's desk faced away from her door, so she never saw Rick coming until his hands were already massaging her shoulders. Completely disgusted, Kate organized an office-wide threat-level program whereby all of the other employees began alerting Kate the minute Rick walked in the door.
When the system failed, she finally took her issues with Rick to the boss.
The boss had to have a private and direct conversation with Rick, instructing him to not make any further attempts to date or harass the employees of his company, and by "employees" he specifically meant "Kate."
A few weeks later, Kate was sitting at home at 9 PM on a Wednesday night when her phone rang.
It was Rick.
Somehow, he had located Kate's home phone number. She does not know how.
Rick wanted to know if Kate would like to meet up with him "for coffee" later that night. And by "coffee," he meant "sexual intercourse." On a Wednesday. At 9 PM. And he lived over an hour away from Kate.
Kate had had enough at this point. She lost her cordial attitude, and gave Rick a fucking earful, saying in as many words .....
"Do not EVER fucking call me at home, Rick. Do not ever contact me again outside of work. Ever!"
Now, as a common, puny, and worthless man, even I would get the hint at this point that, hmmm, maybe this Kate girl doesn't have any interest in me?
Let's look at the evidence.
1. Rick hits on Kate, and she routinely shows no interest.
2. Rick asks Kate out to lunch repeatedly, and she refuses every time.
3. She practically pukes when he tries to give her shoulder massages.
4. Her boss intervenes and instructs Rick to have no further contact with Kate.
5. He ignores that advice, and violates her privacy by somehow acquiring her home phone number.
6. He calls her at home, where she lives with her boyfriend and son, to ask her out for coffee.
7. She tells him in no uncertain terms to go fuck himself.
You think maybe Rick would get the hint?
Well, he wouldn't be on PLFM if he did.
Kate went back to work the next day only to find the following email in her inbox.
From Rick, of course.
Take it away, Romeo.
Hello cutie,
I know you told me not to contact you outside of work, so I'm sending this to your work address. That makes it work related, right? :)
If you haven't guessed by now, I really dig you. The highlight of my week is droping off DNA to your lab, and I would love to make a more direct deposit.
I would treat you like a queen. My wife would never know. We're on the rocks anyway. I'm only staying with her because of the girls. She doesn't satisfy me in bed, the way I know you would with your tight little body.
You figure into my dreams nightly. It's the only satisfaction I get these days.
Let me know when you want to spend a night or more in heaven.
Rick.
What Rick didn't know is that by emailing Kate, he also emailed the entire lab, so everyone got a gander at Rick's final overtures to Kate.
And I say "final" because this is the exact same email Kate used against Rick to obtain a restraining order. If Rick decides to ask Kate out to lunch again, he will now have to yell his question from a distance of at least 1000 feet.
Now, this story may not involve knives to the throat, death threats, or the well-barbequed kittens my readers have developed such a fine taste for.
But I printed this story for a reason.
The weekend prior, this exact topic came up amongst a large group of my female friends twice. And each time, the women were falling all over themselves with horrible stories of dealing with deviant, sometimes psychotic, and often stalkerish behavior from clients and / or customers.
Represented were waitresses, bartenders, real estate agents, saleswomen, baristas, and advertising executives.
PLFM wants to hear YOUR story in the comments, because we know you have them.



Oh, trolls. Getting asked out doesn't bother us a bit. It's not the getting hit on that we object to, it's the stalking and the threats and the disgusting suggestions and emails we object to.
ReplyDelete"Nope, authors of the study."
ReplyDeleteFAILURE. You're quoting a journalist. The quote conveys separate though related background information: attraction to juvenile features in adults (neoteny). 15 year olds have juvenile features, too. The study finds a greater attraction to 15-year-olds. This confirms an attraction to neoteny and an attraction to 15-year-olds. No amount of retardation excuses you to gloss over and ignore the entire premise this article builds on.
You're too retarded to see your quote is actually congruent with the point you object to.
17 is indeed hot.
lrn2fail less hard
HEY THAR PEDO ANON GO FAP TO HIGH SCHOOL MUSICAL K? NO ONE CARES WHAT YOU VOMIT ON UP HERE
ReplyDeleteYour trying argue a point contrary to how researchers define neoteny. Go back to your NAMBLA meetings and your kiddy porn.
ReplyDeleteHoly crap! I can't believe this is still going after more than 600 comments. o_0
ReplyDelete"You're trying to interrupt my horse fellatio. Go back to letting me suck delicious horse dick."
ReplyDeletefix'd
The journalist discussed neoteny.
The researchers surveyed attraction to 15- and 19-year-olds.
You're trying to belie the study's basis when it's glaring right in front of you.
Gb2your la-la land of fantasy, unicorns, and fine menstrual cuisine.
You have infallible subjectivism there (unlike here) and when you suck off the horses, they grant you the courtesy of not wanting to throw up into your mouth.
How about when this thing hits 1000 we crack open a bottle of champagne and CELEBRATE? ^_^
ReplyDeleteAlmost exactly thirty years ago, I worked as a file clerk at a company that *required* the women to wear skirts. My immediate boss liked to save the files that went into the bottom drawers of the filing cabinent just for me. I'd been duly filing folders away when he snuck up behind me, slipped his hand under the hem of my skirt and jabbed his fingers into the crotch of my panties as hard as he could - it fucking hurt! I jumped a few feet and whirled around, tears in my eyes and red-faced, while he laughed like it was the funniest practical joke EVEH! (All the other girls in the office were trying hard not to make eye contact with anyone - they'd been victims, too). I grabbed him by his balls through his trousers and squeezed as hard as I could, saying, "And how do YOU like it, jackass!" He went to the Big Boss, a dried up 80-year-old prune, who fired me. He didn't care that his top salesguy was sexually assaulting his female staff - girls didn't grab men by the crotch as that was 'unseemly' and 'unladylike'. This is, admittedly, back in the Bad Old Days too many of my friends tend to get all nostalgic over. Me? About time girls started fighting back...
ReplyDeleteAlright, I've got 2 stories...I'll be brief...
ReplyDelete1. I worked at a Dunkin Donuts for a summer when I was 19. There was this one guy (looked just like Milton from office space). I would be polite, take his order and ring him up. He always wanted a conversation afterwards and since it was usually 10pm there weren't a lot of excuses for me to be rude and push him out. So he would chat, and the chat would get weird. One conversation was solely about teeth. He told me the work he had had done, the work his friend had done and asked to see my teeth (which I refused) and told me what work I should have done. The next time he came in he was dressed in a Hawaiian shirt, khaki shorts, stockings and red heels. I get cross dressing is fun for some people. But it's odd to walk into D&D and expect normal conversation. I made sure to go in the back and let my coworker deal with him from then on.
2. I have a retired racing greyhound and I love promoting their adoption. I was walking around my neighborhood when I man at a cafe stopped and asked me about my dog. Happy to have a chance to spread the word about greyhound adoption I stopped at talked to him. Huge mistake. The conversation finished normally enough after I answered his greyhound questions. I said goodbye and he stood up and said "I'll walk with you." I didn't know how to politely turn around and go the opposite way so I let him walk with me. Block after block he kept walking and talking. A runner came down the side walk and the guy pulled me to the side, as though I couldn't move on my own. Finally I got tired of him and tried to turn down a side street that I knew would take him out of the way of his destination. But of course he had time to walk that way with me! While on this side street he says to me "You have beautiful eyes" and brushed the hair out of my face. I was beyond creeped out at this point. I am huge on my personal space. Then he made fun of me for being shy and told me that I would look so much more beautiful with makeup on. In response I mentioned that my boyfriend liked me just fine and walked extremely quickly away from him. I looked over my shoulder for the next 3 blocks and took the long way home in fear that he'd follow me!.
I used to work the closing shift at McDonald's through high school. There was one guy who would come in every night I worked and order a Big Mac, I dubbed him Big Mac Guy. Original, I know.
ReplyDeleteAt first Big Mac Guy was a pretty normal customer. He would order his Big Mac and two sachets of salt. After a few weeks, I started just putting his two sachets of salt on the tray, thinking it was good customer service. Big mistake. All of a sudden I knew him like no other, and he could say what he wanted.
I organized children's birthday parties so I wore the managerial uniform (white shirt, blue skirt, no hat) and a badge that read "Party Entertainer". Drunken men would always make jokes about it but Big Mac Guy, sober, would make crude jokes constantly about me entertaining him at a private party.
One day I was on a kneepad, polishing the stainless steel cupboards, when he walked up and placed an order with one of my co-workers. While waiting for his food he looked over at me, gave me a creepy grin, and said, "Melanie on her knees, right where she belongs..."
He started coming in later and later and hanging out by the counter trying to make conversation with me while he shoved Big Mac in his mouth.
Finally, one of our security people said that they saw him standing outside the restaurant watching me after we were closed one night. My pleas to have a male co-worker on the front counter with me for the last hour we were closed were heeded, and Big Mac Guy stopped coming in. I thought it was over.
Wrong.
After a month or so blissful Big Mac Guy-free shifts I got cocky. I was supposed to call someone over to watch me from the doorway when I brought in the garbage cans, but one night I decided to do it myself. They were only 10 feet away, and surely nothing could happen.
Wrong again.
Big Mac Guy emerged from the shadows. I stepped back and placed a foot against the door so that I could kick it and draw attention if he tried anything.
"Good evening, what are you doing out here Melanie?"
"I just had some cleaning to do (goawaygoawaygoaway)"
he stepped forward, arms outstretched.
"Gimme a hug"
he then grabbed me, enveloped me in his creepy arms, burrowed his face into my hair, inhaled deeply, and said, "Mmmmmm, you smell just like a Big Mac"
He pulled away and walked off.
I went back inside, locked the door, and dreamt of the shower I would take as soon as my shift was over.
Oddly enough, despite various high school and college retail and food service jobs, I only had a major harassment episode once - when I was a temp receptionist at a law firm!
ReplyDeleteI looked quite young, more like a teenager than the 22-year-old I was at the time, and at the front desk, I met most of the delivery vendors who came in with office supplies. Most were perfectly nice, and even though I caught a few delivery guys or clients checking me out, if it wasn't blatant, I'd just ignore it. Men will look at young women.
But one of the guys just WOULD. NOT. STOP. TALKING to me. As with many girls in this circumstance, I was young and shy and uncertain of defending myself or telling him to go away. It was quite obvious that he was gearing up to hit on me, and I emailed another woman at the office to ask what I should do. She came to the front to "relieve me while I went to help someone with a project," and Vendor Creep finally left. Then we informed the office management, who in turn informed his company.
He was promptly fired - it was not his first offense, nor the first young woman he'd hit on. He then CAME BACK to my office to find out "what he'd done wrong" and tried to persuade me that he really, really hadn't been trying to get a date with me or anything, he was just trying to be friendly when he blathered at me for thirty minutes! I was really freaked out then, but somebody in the back of the office heard him and sent one of our male assistants out.
Creepy Vendor quickly departed, and one of the building security guards took to hanging out in our lobby for a few weeks.
In all seriousness, I'm pretty sympathetic to feminism.
ReplyDeleteHOWEVER, I get stuck into inane conversations with assholes who don't have anything to say that I want to hear all the fucking time. It's awful, but it's not sexual harassment.
I can't believe you got some poor retard fired for that. What is wrong with you? Maybe you didn't explain what exactly he did that was so offensive very well?
Anonymous: Wow you poor fuckin thing that's almost as bad as getting raped.. go back to the kitchen
ReplyDeleteMy 19 year old sister works for a call centre that deals with financial issues. One time she got a call from a genuine costumer that started out a little creepy and ended up with him audibly masturbating and asking her what she was wearing. She shouted at him, and hung up, and her supervisor did not reprimand her.
ReplyDelete...And then she changed his address to 69 Cleft Street in their system so that if he wants his money he is going to have to list every single address he's lived at for the past 12 years next time he calls.
It may not be above board, but I am so proud of her for not taking that kind of crap. Don't mess with 19 year olds, they will fuck you up! xD
When I was working in the restaurant industry as a teenager I would through out any inappropriate idiot.
ReplyDeleteDang... this thread keeps on going.....
ReplyDeleteMany men really have NO idea what a jungle it still is out there for women. (I'm not talking about the trollfuckers here - they're just pathetic. I'm talking about men who will read these tales of harrassment and say "Well, why didn't you just say/do xyz?"
BECAUSE IN MANY WAYS THE WORLD IS PHYSICALLY AND PSYCHOLOGICALLY DANGEROUS FOR WOMEN IN WAYS THAT MEN DON'T EVEN HAVE TO THINK ABOUT.
It just IS.
"BECAUSE WOMEN HANDLE PROBLEMS IN WAYS THAT WOULD GET MEN CALLED SPINELESS, IMPOTENT COWARDS, BUT GET WOMEN CALLED NORMAL."
ReplyDelete"It just IS."
fix'd
Now that's what feminism is all about!
If women handle problems in an alpha male way it would get them killed.
ReplyDeleteThat's not the alpha male way. That's the typical male way. Even the modest, unglamorous ones learn basic ways to resolve conflicts by themselves without anyone's help just to get by. It's mostly not getting scared (by learning about the situation, preparing for snags) and doing something simple and practical that works in everyone's favor. Force or threats are essentially never required. The ones who end up fighting are drunk or retarded.
ReplyDeleteAnon,
ReplyDeleteI agree with your point. But, how do you deal with an idiot who confronts you while you are alone at night.
That's it! Use the word retarded one more time and I'll... I'll find a way to smack you on the back on the head by courtesy of the internet!
ReplyDeleteIt's an degrading expression that alludes to the misconception that people suffering from autism are stupid. They aren't. You, however, display this quality quite requently.
To sum up, when you deem something or someone retarted, it's the equivalent of proclaiming proudly "I'm a clueless git!".
frequently, not requently
ReplyDeleteshould not type while angry
lol. retards are funny. getting offended only makes it funnier. how do you know I'm not retarded?
ReplyDelete---
Even the not so rugged guys (most of us) get wary of going to the wrong places alone at night. They simply don't take unnecessary risks and prepare what they can before they take necessary ones. They can prepare themselves mentally (know the place, know people, not impair their judgement), minimize distance from their destination, not look like a target (not wear motion confining clothing or carry anything valuable), keep distance from sketchy looking things, draw attention from the right kind of people, walk alongside people like themselves, or look like they belong there and shouldn't be messed with. I think it's so second nature to most people who do this that they're no longer aware.
Men too are at risk. Indeed they are nore likely to be wictims of certain kinds of violence than women. The risk reducing strategies that Anon mentions are to a great extent mirrored by women.
ReplyDeleteHowever, rape by agressors unknown are not the rule. It's the exception. It's not a qustion of individuals lacking street smarts, but the fact that the rapist is a person known to the victim. Indeed initially said person may be deemed trustworthy and the crime often occurs in a setting thought of as safe. Herein lies the especially henious quality of the crime.
"Even the not so rugged guys (most of us) get wary of going to the wrong places alone at night. They simply don't take unnecessary risks and prepare what they can before they take necessary ones. They can prepare themselves mentally (know the place, know people, not impair their judgement), minimize distance from their destination, not look like a target (not wear motion confining clothing or carry anything valuable), keep distance from sketchy looking things, draw attention from the right kind of people, walk alongside people like themselves, or look like they belong there and shouldn't be messed with. I think it's so second nature to most people who do this that they're no longer aware."
ReplyDeleteHeh..... too bad when the "dangerous place" is your own JOB, in what should be a benign location.
Otherwise.... what Artemis said.
To paraphrase Betty Friedan (I think) Feminism is the simple idea that women are People.
Feminism will not win until women are no longer regarded as "other."
Agreed, CP.
ReplyDeleteI was trying to point out that even men try to defuse the situation when out muscled. There's nothing unusual or weak about any of the responses.
I just want to mention that I am eternally grateful to all of the men (or women) that help out younger girls in bad situations.
ReplyDeleteA friend and I were ... well... threatened with death on a subway once, and, long story short, some amazing guy got up and told this freak to 'get the fuck off the train' or something to that effect.
Thank you thank you thank you
And to all of my male co workers to warn me when creepers are coming in, or looking at me etc, managers that let me pretend like Ihaveveryimportantbusinessinthebackofthestoreright.now.
Being a freak doesn't turn us on, it doesn't make us want to date you. It scares us, it makes us run away, it makes us want to cry. I don't often have a "no thanks not interested" ready to spill off my tongue because half the time I'm completely baffled that a supposedly normal person would think it's ok to act that way.
Anon,
ReplyDeleteI once read an article that explained some of the psychology behind aggressive advances. The article liken the male view towards women to their view of weak males. In their eyes a woman is a 90 lbs. weakling. Their approach to weak and nerdy males is physical and verbal intimidation. Now, if you think how common bulling is you will get the picture of how common aggression towards women is.
Cattypex: 'Danger' of getting offended at work is not danger of getting assaulted or mugged alone at night in some sketchy part of town. It's about entirely social and force is almost always absent.
ReplyDeleteUgh, I work as a barista, and while I am "legal", I make a careful attempt to conceal this, as I, in a very literal and non self-depricating sense, could pass for thirteen or fourteen. This makes it all the more horrifying when slobby Jabba the Hutt types make sloppy overtures. I routinely wore my hair in pigtails and had to stop because I had THREE different old men tell me how "cute" I looked in them. Two of these men followed by asking me what college I went to. The highlight of my employment was grinning and telling them I was SO excited to start at the local high school.
ReplyDeleteDon't even get me started on the man who asked me to go to the Canary Islands with him (he's done this now to three girls), or the man who asked me to autograph his receipt because I was so "interesting". To the women in the coffee business: I truly believe we're on the front lines of the war on skeev. Stand strong, sisters.
The ""danger" of getting offended at work" is quite real as many of these stories illustrate. It entails the possibility of the creep in question pouncing on you when you're alone at your place of employment or when leaving said location.
ReplyDeleteAnyway, the implicit dynamics of thing doesn't change due to the absence of force: Instead of banking on superior muscle strengt the creep in question takes advantage of your need for a paycheck, read you and/or kids needing food and a place to stay.
Wow...this thread is pretty addicting. I've had my share of creepers (video store clerk for 10 years) but never turned into stalkers, thank God. I did want to share a story about getting asked out.
ReplyDeleteI was at the local market getting a salad for lunch and the cold drinks were above the salad bar. Now, at 5' I am used to employing all kinds of crazy methods to reach high objects. As it happened a tall guy was also getting a salad and he noticed my struggles and offered to reach down the drink for me. Very nice of him.
At checkout he was behind me in line and when I glanced back I saw it was him and gave him a big smile and said "My hero!". To which of course he responded with a smile of his own and started up a chat. Then he asked me if he could give me his number. Now, I had a BF at the time and quite frankly, even if I didn't, I would not have been interested. However, there were other people in line plus the checkout girl was waaay interested in this whole exchange (as any normal human would be) so I said sure. Finished checking out, and off I went.
In the parking lot he pulled up next to me and started a conversation. He was very nice, and very sweet, but I told him "I'm sorry, I have a boyfriend. I didn't want to say anything in front of everyone in there, but I can't call you."
He took it very well...just said, "If it doesn't work out, you have my number."
I guess what I'm trying to say is that people with a general sense of empathy towards each other navigate these situations everyday, and there is no harm done. My "hero" comment would most definitely be perceived as interest by someone who was interested in me, so he did nothing wrong there. My not revealing the fact that I was not interested in him in front of a bunch of curious strangers was not wrong...and though it may have raised a false hope for a few moments, from my on perspective I would prefer those few moments to public awkwardness.
But too often women find themselves in these situations where, in trying to be polite, they inadvertently encourage more attention. We try so hard not to hurt someone's feelings, assuming men will get the hint of the constant subtle no. Especially women who have to deal with the persistent male client, where they not only have to deal with loss of personal dignity but also possible loss of income. And then, if you do finally pull out the proverbial baseball bat of "NO. NO. A THOUSAND TIMES NO." then you get that all time popular label of "bitch".
And I, personally, do not think for a minute these guys who continue to persist in their quest for a woman who is not interested have no idea of what is really going on. They know they're being told no...they just continue to justify their horrible behavior in their stunted little minds.
'It entails the possibility of the creep in question pouncing on you when you're alone at your place of employment or when leaving said location.'
ReplyDeleteOkay. 'Danger' of getting offended at work and imagining they will be an assaulter/rapist/mugger is not danger of getting assaulted or mugged alone at night in some sketchy part of town. Work is usually safe due to coworkers, managers, or safety procedures. If there is no force or clear threat of force, then you're free to make choice. What precautions you take leaving work ('street smarts') is your choice.
I have two stories. The first involves a customer, the second involves a boss.
ReplyDeleteI worked in a steak restaurant that did delivery and carry out. I answered phones and packaged cold food (salads and stuff). I answered the phone as always, took a man's order for delivery, and finished as I always do with this phrase: "Is there anything else I can do for you?" The man on the phone honestly replied, "Well, is phone sex out of the question?" I was a little shocked.
I was not nearly as shocked by that as I was when, at the same restaurant, one of my male managers asked if I wanted to have a three way with him and his wife because he knew I was a lesbian. He asked on more than one occasion, and I was a minor at the time. *shudder*
Sometimes bosses are as bad as the clients!
Anon said...
ReplyDeleteThey know they're being told no...they just continue to justify their horrible behavior in their stunted little minds.
---
Yes, it's not about asking someone out at all, it's about being aggressive and invading someones space as a means of intimidation. You notice that the aggressive one's have nothing pleasant to say to the subject of their abuse.
Okay. 'Danger' of getting offended at work and imagining they will be an assaulter/rapist/mugger is not danger of getting assaulted or mugged alone at night in some sketchy part of town.
ReplyDelete----------
Why isn't it surprising that you are missing the point again. These aren't everyday guys. These are guys with apparent problems that are fixating on a victim. You never know how far someone like this is going to take it.
Women get attacked mainly in their own homes. They don't have to go to a sketchy part of town.
Because I'm not missing the point. Offending your sense of propriety is not credible cause to imagine someone is abusive. Sociopaths are often deceptively courteous and charming, so it's at least as credible to imagine what horrific things the inoffensive ones may do.
ReplyDeletePeople's cultures and experiences are diverse with divergent views of what's 'proper'. They're not all going to agree with yours or conventional wisdom. Your point that guy's who try to spark interest from a girl at work are really trying to intimidate her does not have merit. You don't honestly know. Guys can be inexperienced, socially awkward, or have the wrong ideas about wooing, so if their efforts aren't working, they may just not know they should try someone else. There is no credible danger in that. Moreover, people do actually meet this way. Has a girl never fancied a client? Should a guy who fancies someone on the job 'accidentally' meet her off the job and woo her there? I don't think you'd like that.
I discussed what to do at sketchy places alone at night only because you asked, not to compare it to anything else.
Just wanted to say that people who say that we're "bitching about nothing" obviously have never had a scary experienceof being alone with a guy who is bigger than you and you don't know what they are going to do next. It's hard to stand up for yourelf and tell them to get away from you when you aren't sure how they'll react. Good blog.
ReplyDeleteI work at the information desk at the student center of a huge university, so it's understandable that some weirdos would come by, if only because there's such a cross-section of the population at the school. But the fellow who habitually hang out at the student center tend to be there because they don't have a dorm to spend time in and are those "older" returning students....or severely socially handicapped.
ReplyDeleteMy stories are two long to really post here in their entirety, but I've had two long-term creepers, one of whom threatened to kill me. Oh, yes.
Two stories same job. The first one was when my 80+ male co worker started to hit on me. First, he'd come and hug me like he did all the employees. then he'd kiss my cheek. He eventually tried to isolate me and succeeded in groping me. I avoided him like the plague!
ReplyDeleteThe second was with a customer. I worked as a cashier. He was buying condoms. He (mid to late thirties) leaned over to me (eighteen) and asked me if I wanted to know what he used them for. I cringed which he took to mean, 'yes, please whip out your little friend in the middle of the store!' I about died. Almost wish someone would do it now that I know what to do about it...
There was a guy who worked in the meat department at a grocery store I was a cashier at. He was 52 and had incredibly bad hygiene--I was 17. He started working at the store about a year after I had, so I had learned how to deal with people. For the most part.
ReplyDeleteThe second day after he got the job, guy--we'll call him Randy--comes up to buy himself break food. Normal behavior. No big issue. I start ringing him up. Then: "You have beautiful breasts."
I pause in my scanning of his items. "What?"
"I would love to touch your breasts."
I turn to fully face him. "That is inappropriate. Do not ever speak like that to me again. I am not interested in you. Next time you do anything similar I will report you for sexual harassment." I mentioned it to my managers and the store owner and they told me to alert them immediately if it happened again.
Cue him avoiding me for a week. Apparently then deciding that I had forgotten it, he comes up to buy his stuff, and as I'm ringing him up, lets out a small moan, reaches out, and -grabs my chest-. And as I lash out and smack his hand, he says: "I knew they'd feel beautiful."
I promptly called my manager to the front and informed him of what had happened.
Randy offered the fantastic argument that "the uniforms and aprons [I] had to wear hid all the beauty that [I] had so he couldn't appreciate me more appropriately."
He was fired less than three minutes later and my boss had him taken to court since apparently I wasn't the only one who complained, though I had the worst case.
Since when does "I'm not interested" work in any context? Most men do not listen to that. Look at the vast number of TV shows and movies that portray men being persistent, not taking no for an answer and getting the girl in the end, who loved him all along but was playing hard to get or some crap.
ReplyDeleteNewsflash. We're not playing hard to get. If we say no, it's because we don't want you.
Sup, /b/, fancy meeting you here, among non-retards. How'd you get out of the clubhouse and into my normal internet? Seems like this sort of thing is above your head.
ReplyDeleteSee, I can tell it's you, because /r9k/'s posts would have been a lot longer/spelled better and would have degenerated into "But seriously, ladies, how do guys get girls to like them? I've tried eveeerrrrryyyythiiiiiinnnngg"
Anyway, hope you and your favorite hand are having a lovely day.
Love,
/co/
xoxo
<3<3<3
Yanno, Anonymous, we could really do without the attention. No, seriously. It's not flattering-- it's creepy and intimidating and disturbing.
ReplyDeleteFrankly, if I get to a point in my life where I'm not being harrassed by random losers, I think that will be NOTHING SHORT OF COMPLETELY AWESOME.
I'm yet to hear from a woman who is jealous of someone else being stalked, harrassed and intimidated, particularly when it's by some of the socially inept, drop-dead fugly losers mentioned here.
I'm yet to hear someone complain about NOT being harrassed.
I used to work in a supermarket, doing nightfill. when I was 19.
ReplyDeleteOne of the staff, a guy we'll call D, I was warned about from the register girls, and the women in Fresh Produce. He was a few years older than me, appeared friendly, and seemed nice to the n00b.
After a bit, the friendliness started getting WEIRD. In that he thought I needed huge amounts of assistance doing my job (I didn't) and would make borderline "jokes" about sex and how good he was in bed. I started getting cold and ignoring him, and just AVOIDING him: I was the new girl, I didn't want to start drama.
Then one evening, I was walking through to the storeroom, and he randomly GLARED at me. I looked away, because I was kind of freaked out. At the end of the shift, I was called into the manager's office, and told off for "Making a mean face at D." I pointed out that no, I didn't, and was THEN told "You wanna watch how you treat D-- he's built like a brick ****house and could do you some damage if he wanted to." D was standing right there. I sort of nodded and went home.
I stopped getting shifts after that, funnily enough. And two weeks later, talking with one of the deli girls, I learned that he'd been cautioned for a third time about harrassing colleagues, and they'd offered him with getting fired or sent to another store. He went to another store.
Then again, this was the same supermarket where one manager introduced me to another manager as "This is Jess..." "What does she do?" "Who cares? She's nineteen and blonde and female."
This story is actually about my mother.
ReplyDeleteWhen my brother and I were younger she worked several different temp jobs to get by and ended up taking a job working in the men's department at a big name retail chain.
One evening when she was working alone in the men's section a gentleman approached her and asked if she could show him some clothing options for his son. She proceeded to take him around the store giving him several options but he seemed indecisive and kept asking to be shown different racks. When she turned to ask him a question she caught him looking up her skirt with a mirror. Needless to say, rather than ask questions she made a run for it.
My mother quit that job not too long after this incident.
Thank you for posting this. As a woman who works in a public service field, it really resonated with me. And thank you for naming these behaviors for what they are--a kind of violence, even if, as you say, it doesn't involve direct death threats or something. It's so hard for women to get management to take stuff like this seriously because, after all, "it's not like he held you up at gunpoint." Argh.
ReplyDelete"He's the macho, small-cocked blowhard keen on making empty threats of physical violence towards others to 'impress' and 'protect' the ladies"
ReplyDeleteIsn't that kinda what you, do, Weaze? I mean, sans violence, of course... all humor aside, isn't this blog basically just an exercise in "impressing and protecting" the ladies?
No means no.
ReplyDeleteMost of you are saying no, and the guys that can't accept that are effing creeps. But in some of these stories, you *aren't saying no*.
You're just avoiding, or ignoring the guys. The guys who are like this, are not the sort of guys who can 'interpret signals'. That's why they think you're interested in the first place.
If you never actually say 'No' to them, then they will think that they haven't made their intentions known. That's why it starts with them hanging out, then they start with the comments, then it escalates to touching, then they're waiting for you outside... They don't think you understand that they want to fuck you.
Believe me, I'm not making excuses for these guys, I'm just trying to let you know where they are coming from so you can better protect yourselves.
If you make it absolutely clear that your answer is no, *most* of these guys will stop.
The ones that do not, however, need to be locked up.
All the trolls here have made me decide that in future, when hit on by guys like them, I will no longer be polite and say 'no thanks, I have a boyfriend' (whether I do or don't). I will instead say 'no fucking way you creepy, ugly weirdo. There is no way that I or any other woman could ever be interested in you'.
ReplyDeleteIs that clear enough?
It may have the added benefit of crushing their ego so much they never bother another woman again.
I've had a lot of instances of sexual harassment over the years. The first was at the age of 11, during school sports - golf at the local golf club. Two sleazy guys in their 30s were loitering around perving at us primary school girls, and asking us if we wanted 'boiled lollies'. Well, fortunately one of my school friends was sassy enough to know what that referred to. Complaint to golf club management - paedos' memberships instantly revoked, police called, and them escorted from the club! Nice!
And another happy outcome - I worked in an office a few years ago, and a new manager, recently divorced guy in his mid 40s, transferred in. He had the disgusting habit of coming to sit next to you on the guise of talking about something work related, then slowly putting his hand on your leg. All the girls were upset by it but there was no-one really to complain or report him to. So, the next time he did it to me, I held my pen in my hand like a knife, and slammed it down hard from great height into his thigh. He squealed like the stuck pig that he was & never returned to the job. I never had to buy a drink for myself at after-work drinks after that!
You know, I want to read all the comments but I'm getting too angry. I WISH this story (and some of the ones in the comments) had invovled knives because some of these @sses need to get stabbed in the face.
ReplyDelete15 years? Most of these stories are about underage girls. There are women well over 50 that still get hit on by men. Men are not all that picky.And after women get to be a certain age, many of them don't really care that much about male attention anyway.
ReplyDeleteAnd yeah, I do think that if a woman is really hot she should only be hit on by men SHE thinks are attractive. After all, her hotness exists to attracts guys SHE likes, not losers like you whiny Anons. Sorry, her hotness doesn't belong to you. It only belongs to her and shared with only those she deems worthy because that's life.
If you don't like it, stop hitting on the 8-10's who will reject you and only hit on the 3's. They will still turn you down, of course, but at least the humiliation of being so totally out of your league will not sting so much.
And if a woman will only date guys that are totally hot or make 6-figure salaries more power to her if she's that hot. When guys are successful or hot (think: rock stars!) they get almost as picky as women do simply because THEY CAN - so what's wrong with it? If you got it, you gotta be elite - not give it out to every loser there is! It's not charity, guys!
And to the other Anon - no one is getting their panties in a bunch..on the contrary we are having fun ridiculing the loser guys who don't know how to date within their own league. THEY are getting THEIR panties in a bunch because they think it's a big deal when a woman rejects them. It's not. It will happen many, many times until they realize that women are human beings pursuing our own interests and we were not put on earth to keep you guys from being lonely. Get a blow up doll or something.
It may sound mean, but really if any of these guys actually took my advice (and started to understand woman= human being, not blow up doll) they'd have much better luck finding dates and wouldn't have to resort to stalking (which won't get you a date anyway.)
So, I'm late to the party, but, I've got a couple of stories:
ReplyDeleteMy first job was at a grocery store, bagging groceries. My usual response to men asking me for my number then was to tell them that God told me to keep myself pure, and to then go tell the manager.
I worked at Wal*Mart in college, where one of the department managers (35ish) decided that I was "like Cinderella", and that I needed to be 'rescued'. He told me he wanted me to quit my job and move in with him, so he could take care of me. He bought all sorts of weird unsolicited gifts for me, and would follow me around the store. He knew when I got off work, and would wait in the parking lot for me. I told the store manager that he was stalking me, and the store manager just told him to cut back a bit. His friends all told me I was a 'frigid bitch'. I still hate Wal*Mart.
I worked for a while in fine jewelry sales. I can't count the number of times I had to tell men that I wasn't interested in going to lunch, or on a date, or hanging out after work, or giving them any form of a discount. I actually had to call the manager to cover for me once: a guy stood at the counter and would not leave me alone for two and a half hours. Now, customer service, you're not supposed to tell the little fuckstains to piss off, you're supposed to be 'nice' to them. However, I just got progressively less responsive to each overture he made. I was not interested in going to live in his trailer on his land with the horses. I didn't care if he had a garden, or that he could 'keep me in style.'
I've also worked as a manager of a coffee shop. The sheer number of men I had to run off from the other girls. Good grief. The most common phrase uttered to a customer should not be "she's not interested, take your coffee and leave."
I've had males yell sexual suggestions at me on the street, I apparently have incredibly attractive breasts (men can't keep their eyes off them), and I've had more unwelcome and unasked for innuendos leveled at me... The day a man has to actually worry about walking down the street for fear of harrassment, the day a man has to repeatedly ask anyone to stop staring at their secondary sexual characteristics, and the day a man reflexively flinches when a stranger addresses them is the day when men get to claim that woman on man harrassment is as bad of a problem as man on woman harrassment.
I will instead say 'no fucking way you creepy, ugly weirdo. There is no way that I or any other woman could ever be interested in you'.
ReplyDeleteIs that clear enough?
Good! That's exactly what we want: unadulterated honesty. Not inept conformity.
So, the next time he did it to me, I held my pen in my hand like a knife, and slammed it down hard from great height into his thigh. He squealed like the stuck pig that he was & never returned to the job. I never had to buy a drink for myself at after-work drinks after that!
Fail. You should have got convicted for assault. You should have done the above, instead.
Oh, man--I'm so glad I don't work in the service industry anymore, and that I'm grown up enough to know what to do. When you're 16, working your first job, and something like this happens? You have no clue.
ReplyDeleteI used to work at McDonald's during the night shift, so it was usually just me and two other people there. My shift managers were awesome, but the store manager was the type of person who would rather make the restaurant $1 off a burger than say, "Stop harassing my employee."
So working the night shift, we'd get a weird assortment of people: some awesome, some... not so much. I had this one car come by and this guy in the backseat, 40s, drunk, and really disgusting, starts saying, "Hey, sweet thing, hey, babydoll, when do you get off? I can show you a good time..."
Mhmm. I ignored him, because I just wanted to get their food and make them leave.
The guy keeps going on, with all of his friends saying, "Dude, shut up," but he won't listen.
Finally I snapped and said, "I'm a bit young for you, don't you think?"
Belligerent, he says, "No! What are you, 20?"
"Try 16," I shot back.
HE KEPT TRYING TO HIT ON ME. Because statutory rape is cool, guys! Erg.
The other wasn't work related, but still creepy as heck. I live in the city now, and there are a lot of whackos. Most are harmless, but occasionally I get a few really creepy ones. So this guy looks perfectly normal, right? I know better than to make eye contact, but we're waiting for the bus when he walks up and asks for the time. Fair enough, I tell him, put my headphones back on, and begin reading again. He keeps talking to me, even though I'm clearly ignoring him.
The bus finally comes and--surprise surprise--he's riding the same one as me. Lovely. He gestures for me to go ahead so I did, only to hear, "I just want to admire the view!" from right behind me. Charming.
I get on the bus, sit in the corner, and clearly put my bags next to me so that he can't sit there. He then proceeds to move them and sit down next to me, then puts his arm around me and starts rubbing my shoulder. I said, "I really don't think this is appropriate" and asked him to move. He ignored me. I didn't know what else to do, so I ended up freezing and sitting there until finally it was my stop (actually one after, because the bus stop was right outside my house and no way was I letting him know where I lived). He ended up getting off the bus with me, pulling me close and *kissing me on the cheek*. I freaked out and ran away as fast as I could, locked my door, and called my friend, who came and stayed with me the rest of the night.
Freakiness!
You american women have a lot of shit in your puny minds...
ReplyDeleteI really would like to hear a serious comment from some men who have been harrassed at work. There don't seem to be too many actual (non-troll) comments/stories about what they have to deal with.
ReplyDeleteA few weeks ago, a phone was ringing in another department and no one was answering it, so I did. The fool had a question about electronics anyway and dialed the wrong extension. His broken English made it difficult to understand what he was looking for in the first place, but I managed to figure out that he wanted an adapter to plug into his iPod, that would convert to his tape deck in his vehicle. I placed him on hold to check for the item and price, then returned to the phone. He proceeded to ask me technical questions about how the device works (as if it's difficult), then asked "Do you just stick it in?" "Yeah, you just... stick it in the tape deck." "Oh, do I stick it hard or slow?" I had to pause to figure out if he was taking the conversation in an inappropriate direction. "Excuse me?" His breathing got heavier and his voice a little lower.. "Do you want me to stick it in hard or slow?" I was just stunned. Is this creep seriously trying to have phone sex with me? Does he honestly believe that I'll be so turned on that I will completely disregard the fact that I'm at work, on a phone where everyone including children can hear my conversation? "I'm sorry, but I don't think I - " He started breathing heavier and tried saying something, but I immediately hung up in total disgust. Because of my phone-rape incident, I no longer answer that department's phone.
ReplyDeletegood moments are really short in our life. just enjoy..........!
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ReplyDeletegood girl
ReplyDeleteboy with the knife was fucking stupid. good intentioned, but the creepy stalker after you could have had a gun
ReplyDeleteyour friend really should not play with weapons unless he knows what he's doing with them. if his dumbass ends up killed because he thought he'd be tough and pull out his knife then shame as it'll be it'll be his fault
besides that brandishing a weapon is:
A) the wrong way to use the weapon
B) going to escalate things unnecessarily
plus god forbid he does end up using it and the cops respond, they're not going to fuck around with him and he'll be all shaky and pumped with adrenaline, probably won't be able to do anything but yell and talk really fast, he'll probably be jerky and he'll have a fucking knife in his hand. cops don't like that. especially when they take that sort of a call
even if he's the one stopping the rape he'll probably be the one getting hit by a taser/getting shot by a jumpy, scared police
i could go on for hours about what a stupid fucking thing that was for your friend to do...
as a former stalker (maybe a future one too, I don't know) I have insight in how they (we?) think. all signs that points to "I'm not interested" are just words and all signs that the person of interest is giving out (such as breathing, looking, glancing, walking by you, saying hi (however reluctant or disgusted) or just plain existing) is key for "I love you and want nothing else but to be yours forever to keep in a little box so as to look at and pet me whenever you feel like it". I'm serious. that's exactly what goes through a stalkers mind.
ReplyDeletenote that I'm one of the more harmless stalkers, for starters I'm a 5'1" girl, but it's still pretty creepy to have me standing outside your bedroom window for hours just waiting to see a glimpse of you when you get home.
I no longer stalk people though. now I have something better, an actual relationship with a real living person that I live together with.
but yeah, you need to be VERY clear for these people to get it.
I would just like to cover a very important point with all of these anonymous douche-bags.
ReplyDeleteA woman should not have to explain herself. She should not have to sit down with a man and tell him all the reasons she finds him repulsive and disgusting. She shouldn't have to do anything beyond stating that she is not interested. Period. End of story. Just because she isn't given a detailed account of why she won't go out with someone doesn't mean she's playing hard to get. It's not an invitation for perseverance. It means no.
I worked at the front desk of a social/tennis club for a summer when I was in my mid-twenties and this disgusting older guy in his 60's went every day (he was a fat, pale, grey-haired guy who didn't even use the facilities - he used to come to use the bar and eat dinner every day). Even though I worked at the front desk whose duty is, besides greeting the people coming in the front door, to make court reservations for people playing tennis. Since he didn't play tennis he had no business hanging around the front desk, but he did anyway. And the sole reason he did was to creep me out (of course he thought he was being slick). While when he had first met me he had talked about his son-who-is-about-my-age, the longer I worked there he started talking about how beautiful I was. Whenever I wore my glasses to work he'd say "you can't hide your beauty/sexiness from me." Then he started talking about one of the other young girls who worked at the desk, an Asian girl about my age. He told me "I think you and ___ are the hottest girls here. I don't usually like Asian girls, but I like her because she has big breasts." Oh, great for her. I'm sure she'll be ecstatic when she finds that out.
ReplyDeleteI usually had my lunch in the bar area...one day he came and sat next to me a little tipsy, and started talking to me. Then he reached over and squeezed my thigh and said "I've heard that Mexican girls have a high libido. Is this true?" After that I quickly left and never ate in the bar again.
Luckily I ended up getting a full scholarship to school soon after that, and was able to quit that job. I never saw that disgsuting pile of petrified dog shit again. But if I do, I'm either going to slap him or give him an earful, or both.
Amazing story. What a delusional dipshit.
ReplyDeleteOh shut up, you whiny misogynist creep.
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You think that *he* is in the worst position? Not the girl half his age that he is trying to corner alone? Because he doesn't understand that her saying 'no' and avoiding him, and calling people to help means she's 'not interested at all'.
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Yes, and a lot of women are DELIGHTED that they no longer have to fucking guard themselves from relentless hounding. I'M SO MUCH HAPPIER SINCE I GOT FAT, YOU DON'T EVEN KNOW.
ReplyDelete